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Thread: Holocron continuity database questions



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Rainbow Droideka


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Re: Holocron continuity database questions
Posted: Dec 14, 2009 5:08 AM   in response to: darthmilo77 in response to: darthmilo77
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They can avoid conflicting with it all they want, but unless it's actually referenced, it remains S-canon, and even if part of it is referenced, that doesn't mean the rest happened.

I see that there's a formal distinction. I'm just curious what the practical distinction is, because I haven't noticed one so far.
darthmilo77


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Re: Holocron continuity database questions
Posted: Dec 13, 2009 7:19 PM   in response to: General Mobo in response to: General Mobo
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I think that's also S-canon. For instance, I think parts of the story form of the X-Wing game in the strategy guide were overruled. For most video games released after the Holocron, which is C-canon, I'd guess that the strategy guides are also C-canon.
General Mobo

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Re: Holocron continuity database questions
Posted: Dec 13, 2009 3:49 PM   in response to: darthmilo77 in response to: darthmilo77
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They can avoid conflicting with it all they want, but
unless it's actually referenced, it remains S-canon,
and even if part of it is referenced, that doesn't
mean the rest happened.

I am not sure if it counts as "reference" (in fact i doubt it does), but the missions are referenced in the strategy guide in the form of stories so does that count?
darthmilo77


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Re: Holocron continuity database questions
Posted: Dec 11, 2009 7:12 AM   in response to: Mith_the_Godling in response to: Mith_the_Godling
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I don't think there's any official released figure, or at least, none that Licensing would share in the forums.
Mith_the_Godling

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Re: Holocron continuity database questions
Posted: Dec 10, 2009 9:50 PM   in response to: Leland Y Chee in response to: Leland Y Chee
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Dear Chee:

Me and my friends Leo and Vess are having difficulties coming to an agreement on clone and droid numbers. Numerous sources (including the Revenge of the Sith novel) indicate 1.2-3 million active clones, but some other C canon novels point to billions, quadrillions, and those sorts of numbers. We saw your last response to the question of clone numbers, but since so many other sources showing higher numbers have come out, we're unsure if your response had become dated.

So, has the canon number of clones and droids gone higher or do they remain the same from your last response on the subject? And if it hasn't, should we consider that the conclusion until you or another official with the authority to do so says otherwise?

Also, what are the numbers regarding the Empire? Did their numbers suddenly jump up to trillions or did they slowly increase over time?
darthmilo77


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Re: Holocron continuity database questions
Posted: Dec 10, 2009 5:21 PM   in response to: Rainbow Droideka in response to: Rainbow Droideka
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They can avoid conflicting with it all they want, but unless it's actually referenced, it remains S-canon, and even if part of it is referenced, that doesn't mean the rest happened.
Rainbow Droideka


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Re: Holocron continuity database questions
Posted: Dec 10, 2009 10:17 AM   in response to: DarthMRN in response to: DarthMRN
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I'm a little confused about the idea of S-canon being "optional" - it seems like they still try pretty hard not to contradict stuff from a variety of sources that I've heard referred to as S-canon. In fact, I don't even feel like there are any more conflicts between new sources and S sources than between new sources and older C sources.
DarthMRN


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Re: Holocron continuity database questions
Posted: Dec 10, 2009 1:48 AM   in response to: DarthMRN in response to: DarthMRN
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About the preceding mission, assuming my line of reasoning is correct, the same rules should apply to it too, namely that a later source can choose whether to contradict it or adhere to it (the latter making it C-canon), at will. You will have to decide for yourself whether you consider a source that future works are not bound by to be "canon" or not. I am personally not of that opinion, because it violates the very definition of continuity, but I have met fans who disagree.

Or you can just keep an eye on the thread and hope Leland decides to give an explicit answer.
DarthMRN


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Re: Holocron continuity database questions
Posted: Dec 10, 2009 1:44 AM   in response to: General Mobo in response to: General Mobo
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I cannot cite a post from Leland saying XWA has been overridden. But I can cite one where he says all video games created before the Holocron were initially designated S. I can cite one where he tells us the Holocron was started in 2000. And I can cite ones where he defines that S-canon means optional continuity. And I am not aware of XWA having been elevated to C-canon status since then. So, it should be correct if one puts the evidence together, but it is by no means explicit, and for all we know XWA has been elevated without outside knowledge of such (though given that it apparently was contradicted by RS2, that seems unlikely).
General Mobo

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Re: Holocron continuity database questions
Posted: Dec 9, 2009 11:34 PM   in response to: DarthMRN in response to: DarthMRN
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Assuming the above statement is correct (no offense meant since it has not been officially confirmed, but the argument makes sense), what does that say about the previous XWA mission(where the plans are put onto the Razor) is that still canon?
DarthMRN


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Re: Holocron continuity database questions
Posted: Dec 8, 2009 11:35 AM   in response to: General Mobo in response to: General Mobo
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In Rogue Squadron 2 and X-Wing Alliance there are missions concerning the capture of the Corvette Razor which battle is canon?

Presumably Rogue Squadron 2. XWA was made before Holocron testing, making it initially S-canon, which means later (tested) sources, such as RS2, were free to override it as the creators saw fit.
starfighterpilo...

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Re: Holocron continuity database questions
Posted: Dec 7, 2009 3:46 PM   in response to: General Mobo in response to: General Mobo
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does anyone know anything about the whole mandalorians now being pacifists thing
i hope not that is really stupid
hope that gets changed back
General Mobo

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Re: Holocron continuity database questions
Posted: Dec 7, 2009 3:17 PM   in response to: Nathan P. Butler in response to: Nathan P. Butler
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In Rogue Squadron 2 and X-Wing Alliance there are missions concerning the capture of the Corvette Razor which battle is canon? The one where Ace defends the Razor or Rogue squadron?
Nathan P. Butler


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Re: Holocron continuity database questions
Posted: Dec 6, 2009 10:13 PM   in response to: Jason Fry in response to: Jason Fry
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See, I wouldn't put it that way. Granted, you didn't catch the reference, but . . . neither did Lightsaber Duels. That makes me wonder, since I don't recall many sources other than just the TCW novelization that ever called the ship the "Spirit of Republic."

Part of me thinks that was an early draft name that might not have been altered by the release date of the novelization. Hence the question. :)
Jason Fry


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Re: Holocron continuity database questions
Posted: Dec 6, 2009 9:44 PM   in response to: Nathan P. Butler in response to: Nathan P. Butler
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I asked Jason Fry, and he said that no one had ever
made him aware of the "Spirit of Republic," when
writing, hence it being noted as the "Resolute."

Put more simply, I screwed up. Missed the reference. My fault.
Dylax


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Re: Holocron continuity database questions
Posted: Dec 6, 2009 2:28 PM   in response to: darthmilo77 in response to: darthmilo77
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*I think most of them were retconned. There is a retcon for why post-prequel Jedi have all kinds of colors, but to my knowledge there's no official statement on the whole topic. The only non-AOTC color that I'm aware of that was officially addressed was Mace Windu's lightsaber, the explanation being that he was borrowing someone else's blue lightsaber for a while.
*

Ah ok. Its just something I noticed while flipping through my old comics. I think I do remember something about Mace's lightsaber trade now that you mention it.
darthmilo77


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Re: Holocron continuity database questions
Posted: Dec 6, 2009 10:33 AM   in response to: Dylax in response to: Dylax
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In most Prequel era EU released prior to ATOC Jedi are depicted wielding a rainbow of lightsaber colors.

I think most of them were retconned. There is a retcon for why +post+-prequel Jedi have all kinds of colors, but to my knowledge there's no official statement on the whole topic. The only non-AOTC color that I'm aware of that was officially addressed was Mace Windu's lightsaber, the explanation being that he was borrowing someone else's blue lightsaber for a while.
Nathan P. Butler


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Re: Holocron continuity database questions
Posted: Dec 6, 2009 10:02 AM   in response to: Dylax in response to: Dylax
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In the Clone Wars Season 1 Guide, the TCW film has Yularen's ship listed as the Resolute.

Previously, it was noted as the Spirit of Republic in the TCW novelization, and it was suggested that the Resolute replaced the Spirit of Republic when it became one of three ships under Anakin between the film and the events of Wild Space (and thus Downfall of a Droid).

I asked Jason Fry, and he said that no one had ever made him aware of the "Spirit of Republic," when writing, hence it being noted as the "Resolute."

Interestingly, the TCW Lightsaber Duels video game also, I believe, names the ship the Resolute in the TCW era, even when it shouldn't, for the training level duel between Anakin and Ahsoka in the hangar bay.

So, my question: Is the Venator that Yularen commands in the TCW film the Spirit of Republic or the Resolute?
Dylax


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Re: Holocron continuity database questions
Posted: Dec 6, 2009 9:40 AM   in response to: DarthMRN in response to: DarthMRN
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I'm not sure if I've ever seen this addressed before.

In most Prequel era EU released prior to ATOC Jedi are depicted wielding a rainbow of lightsaber colors. For example Plo Koon is shown to have a a Yellow blade while A'Shared Hett wields two Crimson ones. Of course following ATOC all these Jedi were shown to have only Blue or Green blades. Have their pre-ATOC blades been retconned into being Blue or Green or did they all just switch to Blue or green. I think the latter would be rather silly but like I said I don't know if its ever been addressed.
DarthMRN


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Re: Holocron continuity database questions
Posted: Dec 4, 2009 7:48 AM   in response to: Rainbow Droideka in response to: Rainbow Droideka
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Question, Leland:

Since such facts as dates and such get changed so much, that must either mean the Holocron automatically treats the entire source or entry of an erroneous date as non-continuity, OR that individual facts can be demoted to non-continuity independent of their entry or source. Presumably the latter is the case.

But if so, does the Holocron track the canon level of individual facts too? Can you elaborate on how this then fits into the whole?

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