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Thread: EU Leadup to Revenge of the Sith



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CaptainLu306


Posts: 95
Registered: 12/16/99
Re: EU Leadup to Revenge of the Sith
Posted: Mar 26, 2005 10:25 PM   in response to: CooperTFN in response to: CooperTFN
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But that presupposes that the Battle of Coruscant is a little longer than is credibly believed. I really don't think it's that big of a deal to strike one of the "Coruscant is under attack" scenes altogether. It's the lesser of two evils.

I believe The Battle of Coruscant does take place over a few days, so it is credible.
Kreuzader


Posts: 51
Registered: 04/14/02
Re: EU Leadup to Revenge of the Sith
Posted: Mar 26, 2005 9:33 PM   in response to: Leland Y Chee in response to: Leland Y Chee
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Yeah, I'm just basing this on what Tasty Taste has said plus the cartoon hooks Luceno apparently put in (the Nelvaan references).

I agree it'd be better if Nelvaan could be placed before Coruscant.
CooperTFN


Posts: 76
Registered: 12/22/99
Re: EU Leadup to Revenge of the Sith
Posted: Mar 26, 2005 9:17 PM   in response to: Kreuzader in response to: Kreuzader
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But that presupposes that the Battle of Coruscant is a little longer than is credibly believed. I really don't think it's that big of a deal to strike one of the "Coruscant is under attack" scenes altogether. It's the lesser of two evils.
Kreuzader


Posts: 51
Registered: 04/14/02
Re: EU Leadup to Revenge of the Sith
Posted: Mar 26, 2005 8:00 PM   in response to: Leland Y Chee in response to: Leland Y Chee
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Edit: I guess the proposed sequence of events is

-They get orders on the bug world to head to Nelvaan
-For some reason, Kenobi and Skywalker never get around to doing this (if the bug world is Cato Neimodia, it could be because Yoda personally directs them to hunt for Sidious, which I like the idea of)
-They follow the trail through Tythe
-At Tythe they receive word Coruscant is under attack, but since Dooku did the hyperspace fake to Nelvaan, they head there instead, per their original orders from Palpatine.
-Nelvaan adventure
-Once back on the ship, they get the message from Mace that Palpatine has been abducted.

That's a bit messy, but I guess it works.
Nathan P. Butler


Posts: 4,653
Registered: 10/11/01
Re: EU Leadup to Revenge of the Sith
Posted: Mar 26, 2005 7:35 PM   in response to: CooperTFN in response to: CooperTFN
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And we still somehow end up with them on the cruiser leaving Tythe being told by Palpy about the situation on Coruscant, prompting their immediate return to the capital . . . and them on the cruiser leaving Nelvaan being told by Mace about the situation on Coruscant, prompting their immediate return to the capital.

Nelvaan is mentioned in the same scene where they get the message from Palpy and begin racing for Coruscant.

For a "fix," having them go from Tythe to Nelvaan then Coruscant really doesn't make any sense, unless the mentions of Nelvaan are stricken from LOE, but then we have to still account for that month on the "ewww, Anakin's eating bugs" planet between LOE's final segment on Tythe and the call to return to Coruscant.
CooperTFN


Posts: 76
Registered: 12/22/99
Re: EU Leadup to Revenge of the Sith
Posted: Mar 26, 2005 4:09 PM   in response to: RaphusLee in response to: RaphusLee
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+ The cartoon portions of Nelvaan take place just after they are mentioned in Labyrinth. The placement of the scenes (in both the novel and the cartoon) make it appear that certain events are taking place simultaneously for dramatic effect when they actually are not.+

Wait, what? I thought the LoE reference indicated that Nelvaan does happen at the same time as Coruscant.
RaphusLee


Posts: 46
Registered: 06/06/03
Re: EU Leadup to Revenge of the Sith
Posted: Mar 26, 2005 12:01 PM   in response to: whiteknight767 in response to: whiteknight767
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whiteknight767 said on Mar 23, 2005 03:43 PM
Anakin's knighthood takes place just after "Jedi Trial", as the conversation at the end of Jedi trial is a private one, and the one in episode 21 is the final decision

So, between the Battle of Hypori and Anakin's Knighthood, a lot of months take place, right? Because the promotion ceremony in Chapter 21 must be after "Jedi Trial".
However, when the Council decides to promote Anakin, Ki-Adi-Mundi is explaining the events on Hypori and the fight with Grievous... more than two years after it happened!
How do you see this?

And, speaking of which, Obi-Wan is already a member of the Council (in Chapter 21). It's explained somewhere in which moment is he admitted as a member, and who is he replacing?
Nathan P. Butler


Posts: 4,653
Registered: 10/11/01
Re: EU Leadup to Revenge of the Sith
Posted: Mar 26, 2005 11:05 AM   in response to: Ambu_Fett in response to: Ambu_Fett
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In conclusion, each story was created to be enjoyed independently of the other. Enjoy them for what they are.*

By that reaoning then, you've said numerous times in the past that when things contradict, there'll have to be some weighing out to determine what takes precedence so that they can be referenced later. So, given references in the ROTS novelization (that some places have improperly released early) to Luceno's LOE, are we to assume that at least for the sake of future references back to the days of the Battle of Coruscant that it'll be the LOE/ROF version of events that are referenced, not the cartoon's? (Similar, say, to referencing back to the Battle of Mon Calamari in Dark Empire as opposed to the final level of the original Rogue Squadron game.)

I don't think fans need a 100% fix. They just need to know what "history" is going to accept as the "clearest window" (in Chris Cerasi terms, heh) into those events.
Ambu_Fett


Posts: 74
Registered: 07/22/03
Re: EU Leadup to Revenge of the Sith
Posted: Mar 26, 2005 8:49 AM   in response to: Darth Mane3 in response to: Darth Mane3
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But before Nelvaan they were on this world in the outer rim (Obi-Wan says they'd been there for a month already) and it also seems to me that after Tythe they are going directly to Coruscant (Anakin gets very excited and I don't think he'd make a detour and go to Nelvaan). And also, what reason would there still be to go to Nelvaan? I believe if Anakin thought Grievous was on Nelvaan he'd still rather go to Coruscant to protect Padmé and the Chancellor).
But still, thanks Tasty :).
Darth Mane3

Posts: 239
Registered: 06/20/03
Re: EU Leadup to Revenge of the Sith
Posted: Mar 26, 2005 8:25 AM   in response to: Leland Y Chee in response to: Leland Y Chee
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Ok, but people want fixes, because these continuity problems aren't SMALL. I don't call two Grevious entering one way in one source, and differently in another source, small.

Come on here. Grevious never dances on a roof, before jumping inside the droid gunship, you can't fix stuff like that. If you actually read LOE, you know that Grevious never has time to get inside the bloody room. He nevers walks down the wall with an elevator, and by god the JEdi never carrie Pal everywhere. Pal's protected by his Red Guards the entire time.

You can fix Nelvaan, you can probably have Tin board the Sepy ship, but you can't have the Grevious/Pal capture parts. They contradict everything.
Leland Y Chee


Posts: 1,450
Registered: 05/05/00
Re: EU Leadup to Revenge of the Sith
Posted: Mar 26, 2005 7:57 AM   in response to: Leland Y Chee in response to: Leland Y Chee
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The cartoon portions of Nelvaan take place just after they are mentioned in Labyrinth. The placement of the scenes (in both the novel and the cartoon) make it appear that certain events are taking place simultaneously for dramatic effect when they actually are not.

With any story, writers choose only those parts of the events that they can effectively portray and they feel is crucial to the story they are trying to tell. Hence you don't get the full picture of everything Mace Windu does during the Battle of Coruscant just by watching the cartoon or just by reading the novel. Even within the same scene, you might not be getting the entire picture of all the events taking place because of what the camera or writer focuses on (hence Stass Allie is not seen with Shaak Ti in the cartoon; these events are taking place just offscreen .)

One other thing to keep in mind is that the target audience for the cartoons and the novels is different so they will each have a different approach to storytelling. As a result, certain action scenes and Jedi abilities sometimes will be exagerated in the cartoon a bit.

In conclusion, each story was created to be enjoyed independently of the other*. Enjoy them for what they are.

*Note that the online comic strip "Reversal of Fortune" acknowledges both sources and was written with both the cartoon and novel in mind.
rogue21579


Posts: 18
Registered: 10/01/03
Re: EU Leadup to Revenge of the Sith
Posted: Mar 26, 2005 7:07 AM   in response to: Leland Y Chee in response to: Leland Y Chee
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Yeah.. it will be interesting to see what Tythe and Nevlaan will say in the databank.
Ambu_Fett


Posts: 74
Registered: 07/22/03
Re: EU Leadup to Revenge of the Sith
Posted: Mar 26, 2005 6:53 AM   in response to: rogue21579 in response to: rogue21579
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I think it would work, yes, but I like the version in which the Nelvaan-events take place earlier in the war (32 months after Geonosis) during the Outer Rim-sieges better. Obi-Wan and Anakin do nothing during that month ;). But we'll have to wait and see if any official version will be made public.
rogue21579


Posts: 18
Registered: 10/01/03
Re: EU Leadup to Revenge of the Sith
Posted: Mar 26, 2005 6:51 AM   in response to: Ambu_Fett in response to: Ambu_Fett
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Possible LOE spoilers:


In my mind... the minor inconsistencies (like number of Jedi in Palpy's room, and how he got to the shelter, etc.) don't bother me. But here is my solution to the Tythe vs. Nevlaan. Nevlaan never happened.... While preparing to leave for Coruscant, Anakin drifts into a vision which are the events of Nevlaan. In the cartoon, we never seem them leave. So at the end of Chapter 25, Anakin and Obi depart as told in LOE. What do you guys think...? It could work right? any thoughts?

Ambu_Fett


Posts: 74
Registered: 07/22/03
Re: EU Leadup to Revenge of the Sith
Posted: Mar 26, 2005 3:53 AM   in response to: ≈Suzanne&... in response to: ≈Suzanne&...
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I've worked out all the inconsistencies in my timeline. Saddly it's in German and I don't want to rewrite all the descriptions to post it here (besides it's too long ;)).
But perhaps Tasty can give us the official version now that chapter 25 has been released :).
≈Suzanne&...


Posts: 22,478
Registered: 08/07/01
Re: EU Leadup to Revenge of the Sith
Posted: Mar 25, 2005 11:53 PM   in response to: Rainbow Droideka in response to: Rainbow Droideka
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There seem to be a couple of inconsistencies with the RotS novelisation as well, but I assume that given what Pabawan said about novelisation issues only being allowed in that one thread that we won't be able to ask about those in here either until after May 19?
Rainbow Droideka


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Re: EU Leadup to Revenge of the Sith
Posted: Mar 25, 2005 9:18 PM   in response to: AST-AZ in response to: AST-AZ
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*She is in many of the Republic comics

she is also in the book Jedi Trial*

Ventress is also in some of the Jedi comics (included with the Republic series in the Clone Wars graphic novels), and in The Cestus Deception.

About this whole Labyrinth/Cartoons contradiction, you guys don't need to freak out about it. There will probably be some reasonable solution, and if not, its not the end of the world. I don't see anyone pulling their hair out over contradictions between the movies and their novelizations.

AST-AZ

Posts: 3
Registered: 07/15/03
Re: EU Leadup to Revenge of the Sith
Posted: Mar 25, 2005 8:57 PM   in response to: Leland Y Chee in response to: Leland Y Chee
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Grievous comes in, like in cartoon, Palps gives his talk, gunboat retreats, Allie and Red guards take on Droids, Greivous pushes Palps, Pestage helps him up, they all retreat. (Ignore paragraph in LOE about Shaak looking out the window (unless this is considered a different window))

LOE 280-281 (Group moves into hallway, talk about and head to turbolift)

Elevator scene from cartoon, Ithorian repulses Grievous, Grievous follows turbolift, everything happens as shown in cartoon.

LOE 282 (Shaak finds tunnel, heads for east skydock)

East skydock surrounded by droids, Shaak repulses droids, the group heads for Mag-Lev station, Mag lev station scene happens as in cartoon.

I'll probably work out the rest, as well as solve some issues w/ the summary above later, as it's really getting late.
AST-AZ

Posts: 3
Registered: 07/15/03
Re: EU Leadup to Revenge of the Sith
Posted: Mar 25, 2005 8:52 PM   in response to: Leland Y Chee in response to: Leland Y Chee
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Alright, go easy on me; first post and all that. But, after rewatching the episodes and rereading LOE chapter 44, I think I got a tentative breakdown for Palps' capture:

LOE: Pgs. 276-277 up to the words "Shaak Ti told herself"

Clone Wars episode 23 (Shaak Ti enters room, Holds safety protocol conversation w/ Palps, Grievous crawls down wall on recon to ensure Palps is there, Palps hears thumping, Grievous sees Palps, Shaak doesn't see Grievous, Grievous then climbs back up wall to waiting gunboat.

LOE 277-280 up to "Beaten, the battle droids broke off their attack." (Stass, having sensed Grievous' presence, rushes into room w/ advisors (This uses 2nd quest's idea about the 2 different rooms), they all grab Palps, battle droids break through, they repulse the droids)

Continued below
Darth Mane3

Posts: 239
Registered: 06/20/03
Re: EU Leadup to Revenge of the Sith
Posted: Mar 25, 2005 8:15 PM   in response to: CaptainLu306 in response to: CaptainLu306
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"Think of Labyrinth of Evil as an adaptation of the cartoon; a more realistic portrayal of the same events. We see things in the cartoon that we don't see in the book. And the opposite is true as well. "

This is not a matter of added scenes to event's these are completely different situations in events.

Grevious can't enter the room, because LOE deemed it can't be so. You can't fix the Palpatine capture, it's over, done with. It's a matter of choosing which source fits the best.

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