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Thread: Books, Comics, & Television VIPs


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Grand Moff Magn...


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Re: Welcome some BCaT VIPs
Posted: May 9, 2006 7:48 AM   in response to: James T. Skywal... in response to: James T. Skywal...
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Well, I have heard a quote attributed to one of the FX people implying it was meant to be an earlier ship but obviously a related design. Conversely, they do seem to have gone to a lot of trouble to duplicate the ANH interior sets exactly, and I gather the official position is it's the same ship.

Well, there's more than that. The proportions are off (especially the cockpit section and the midship section which is fat and stubby compared to the slender lines of the ANH ship), there's a section of the ship missing between the main body of the ship and the engine section (a section which is often missing from some RPG material) and the neck of the ROTS ship is inverted.
As for the size, it seems pretty much the same as the ANH ship, especially compared to the shots of Grievous' fighter when it flies by the lower domes. However, in some shots it does appear smaller (such as in the shot of it taking off from the Executive Building), but that could be perspective.
Tresk Im'nel


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Re: Welcome some BCaT VIPs
Posted: May 9, 2006 5:38 AM   in response to: O.J. in response to: O.J.
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I wonder about that. If it is the same ship then why is it shorter in ROTS than it is in ANH. Was it a mistake or was it done on purpose? Did they think that we wouldn't notice?

Well, I have heard a quote attributed to one of the FX people implying it was meant to be an earlier ship but obviously a related design. Conversely, they do seem to have gone to a lot of trouble to duplicate the ANH interior sets exactly, and I gather the official position is it's the same ship.

Either way, the change in hull length could conceivably be the result of a major refit, there are plenty of real-world precedents for that: The B.C. Ferry Corporation's V-class car ferries have been lengthened and had an extra car deck added to boot. Also the WWII aircraft carrier HMS Victorious underwent a major refit in the 1950s in which her hull was both lengthened and widened. So a plug being added to the primary hull during refit is entirely credible, IMHO...
O.J.


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Registered: 12/15/99
Re: Welcome some BCaT VIPs
Posted: May 9, 2006 5:28 AM   in response to: Tresk Im'nel in response to: Tresk Im'nel
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I gather that it has been officially established that
the Tantive IV in ROTS is supposed to be the
same ship as in ANH and not simply another vessel of
the same name. Are there any plans to describe the
specifics of her refit and hull extension in upcoming
materials?

I wonder about that. If it is the same ship then why is it shorter in ROTS than it is in ANH. Was it a mistake or was it done on purpose? Did they think that we wouldn't notice?
Tresk Im'nel


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Re: Welcome some BCaT VIPs
Posted: May 9, 2006 5:07 AM   in response to: James T. Skywal... in response to: James T. Skywal...
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That's true, but there's at least three roughly uniform designs out there, all seen in ROTJ.

Good point. It could be that the Mon Calamari build at least semi-standardised hulls with a modular design that allows them to vary certain systems a bit, and position the various blisters differently. That seems more credible than designing a completely new vessel from the keel out each time.

Tresk, welcome back from your prolonged absence

Thanks! :D Good to be back. ;)
Tresk Im'nel


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Re: Welcome some BCaT VIPs
Posted: May 9, 2006 5:06 AM   in response to: Leland Y Chee in response to: Leland Y Chee
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Is Winter's full (married) name actually Winter Retrac Celchu or is that speculative at this time? ?:|

And while I'm at it...any word yet on Mon Mothma's marital status, whether Jobin was a given name or a surname and what Lieda's surname is?

Not to my knowledge.

Ah, well, it's fairly straightforward to infer what the changes were at least on a superficial level. Thanks for the reply. :)

or the AT-AT debate...

I had long since written that one off as resolved. :p

If you have no idea what any of these debates are about, take my advice and save yourself some agony: don't ask.

ROFL! :^O I know what you mean. ;)

I'm just full of helpful information today, aren't I?

No worries. ;) Thanks for your time. :)
Rainbow Droideka


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Re: Welcome some BCaT VIPs
Posted: May 9, 2006 1:37 AM   in response to: Nex: The T is H... in response to: Nex: The T is H...
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Tresk, welcome back from your prolonged absence. ;)

Tasty:

If you have no idea what any of these debates are about, take my advice and save yourself some agony: don't ask.

:D Well put. And don't worry, you're way too helpful on average for anyone to hold a few unknowns against you. :)
Nex: The T is H...


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Re: Welcome some BCaT VIPs
Posted: May 8, 2006 3:37 PM   in response to: James T. Skywal... in response to: James T. Skywal...
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Hehe. I can see where Leland's exasperation comes from. These debates can be aggravating to say the least. :p
KuatiKid

Posts: 103
Registered: 04/07/06
Re: Welcome some BCaT VIPs
Posted: May 8, 2006 10:30 AM   in response to: Leland Y Chee in response to: Leland Y Chee
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At least you're honest. ;P

Thanks anyway.
Leland Y Chee


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Re: Welcome some BCaT VIPs
Posted: May 8, 2006 10:05 AM   in response to: James T. Skywal... in response to: James T. Skywal...
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do you know if the hangarless upside-down SD hull was supposed to be a different type of ship back in 1983
I have no idea.

Tantive IV... Are there any plans to describe the specifics of her refit and hull extension in upcoming materials?
Not to my knowledge.

Home One debate...
Nothing new in the the works... or the AT-AT debate... or the AT-TE debate (+Star Wars Chronicles: The Prequels+ has the current official length)... or any of the other debates about official dimensions vs. onscreen dimensions. If you have no idea what any of these debates are about, take my advice and save yourself some agony: don't ask.

I'm just full of helpful information today, aren't I?
KuatiKid

Posts: 103
Registered: 04/07/06
Re: Welcome some BCaT VIPs
Posted: May 8, 2006 5:46 AM   in response to: James T. Skywal... in response to: James T. Skywal...
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(As an aside, it has occurred to me that the only reason Home One isn't rated as a battleship or battlecruiser may be the Mon Cals' normally peaceful cultural inclinations).
The HO was actually mentioned as being a battleship in "Star Wars Trilogy Scrapbook: The Rebel Alliance" (with a wrong picture, though).

"Of course, the fact that no two MonCal ships are completely identical may also be a factor."
That's true, but there's at least three roughly uniform designs out there, all seen in ROTJ. The HO ships, the Liberty ships (Liberty is the first one to get hit by the DSII) and the Liberty ships that didn't have those "wings" on each side. These three designs are shown throughout the film, so any differences in individual ships would either be internal or cosmetic. (Possibly having those "bumps" positioned differently on each ship.
KuatiKid

Posts: 103
Registered: 04/07/06
Re: Welcome some BCaT VIPs
Posted: May 8, 2006 5:31 AM   in response to: Tresk Im'nel in response to: Tresk Im'nel
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"Except I've never seen any flame wars over the Home One"
Word. The others are bad enough. ;P

"has any source specifically stated that Home One was 1.2 km or has that simply been the inference"
I think sources have done both, so far.

"Of course it could be that the MC80a designation covers a whole series of conversions "
That's a good idea, and it could work if you have an MC80-, MC80a- and an MC80b-series. What differences exist between individual ships would be small enough to lump most together into one of the above categories.

I made a primitive measurement of the HO model (from Behind the Magic) and unless there's perspective trouble involved, the rough length is 78,5 times the height of the hangar door. With 1200m, the 20m tall shuttle wouldn't fit through (and even that might be too short in the books + extra meters for clearance.)
Tresk Im'nel


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Re: Welcome some BCaT VIPs
Posted: May 7, 2006 8:48 PM   in response to: Tresk Im'nel in response to: Tresk Im'nel
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Basically, it's a similar situation to the Executor debate, mainly to do with its size

Except I've never seen any flame wars over the Home One...go figure. ;) Don't get me wrong, though, I'm not complaining... :p
Tresk Im'nel


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Registered: 09/26/03
Re: Welcome some BCaT VIPs
Posted: May 7, 2006 8:47 PM   in response to: KuatiKid in response to: KuatiKid
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Interesting point, KuatiKid, although, and I'm sorry to sound so stupid, but has any source specifically stated that Home One was 1.2 km or has that simply been the inference from its being considered an MC80a-series?

Of course it could be that the MC80a designation covers a whole series of conversions with different series numbers such as MC80a, MC83a, etc. That might explain why a heavy cruiser such as Home One gets lumped together with ships barely a kilometer long. (As an aside, it has occurred to me that the only reason Home One isn't rated as a battleship or battlecruiser may be the Mon Cals' normally peaceful cultural inclinations). Of course, the fact that no two MonCal ships are completely identical may also be a factor.
JediFighterPilo...


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Re: Welcome some BCaT VIPs
Posted: May 7, 2006 11:04 AM   in response to: KuatiKid in response to: KuatiKid
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Bye Sue, eat some chocolate for me :D puts a heater in Sue's place to keep it warm
KuatiKid

Posts: 103
Registered: 04/07/06
Re: Welcome some BCaT VIPs
Posted: May 7, 2006 7:41 AM   in response to: James T. Skywal... in response to: James T. Skywal...
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Throwing in something extra here, since the Home One debate is still on-going. Basically, it's a similar situation to the Executor debate, mainly to do with its size. Now, I've seen just about every book ever published on the subject, say it's a MC80 etc etc Star Cruiser that's 1200m long. Most of the shots in ROTJ showed it at least 3 times that long, and I swear I've seen comics that have it dwarf other MC80 ships as well. Basically, it's the old visuals vs. text problem, here. I remember seeing a Q&A on the community section mention that it wasn't a singular design, so that's taken care of. Now the main issue is with its size (and possibly, its name, since its model is very different from the other seen). Any light to shed or is that off-limits due to future publications? =)
Tresk Im'nel


Posts: 46,836
Registered: 09/26/03
Re: Welcome some BCaT VIPs
Posted: May 7, 2006 7:12 AM   in response to: Darth-Jango in response to: Darth-Jango
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Enjoy your vacation, Sue. :)

While we're on the subject of ships, and I'm sorry if this question is redundant on account of my prolonged absence:

I gather that it has been officially established that the Tantive IV in ROTS is supposed to be the same ship as in ANH and not simply another vessel of the same name. Are there any plans to describe the specifics of her refit and hull extension in upcoming materials?

Furthermore, even if it was just a money-saving use of kitbash model, that doesn't matter. That's an out-of-universe explanation, and coming up with an in-universe explanation is a lot better. I fail to see the problem with Saxton explaining this confusing visual in a cool way, by naming a new class of Star Destroyer.

Hear, hear! I love seeing the obscure bits of the films fleshed out in the EU... And those who know me know I'm always keen to see new classes of starships established in the EU. ;)
O.J.


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Re: Welcome some BCaT VIPs
Posted: May 6, 2006 12:07 PM   in response to: Darth-Jango in response to: Darth-Jango
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Hope you have a good vacation, Sue!
Darth-Jango

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Registered: 12/02/02
Re: Welcome some BCaT VIPs
Posted: May 6, 2006 6:35 AM   in response to: James T. Skywal... in response to: James T. Skywal...
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The thing looks the bottom of Star Destroyer without a hangar, NOT the top of a Star Destroyer. Furthermore, even if it was just a money-saving use of kitbash model, that doesn't matter. That's an out-of-universe explanation, and coming up with an in-universe explanation is a lot better. I fail to see the problem with Saxton explaining this confusing visual in a cool way, by naming a new class of Star Destroyer.
KuatiKid

Posts: 103
Registered: 04/07/06
Re: Welcome some BCaT VIPs
Posted: May 6, 2006 4:07 AM   in response to: James T. Skywal... in response to: James T. Skywal...
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I've been checking out that page, and everything on it corresponds with the film. Even the novel with the concept art follows the events so precisely, I was surprised! Didn't know that! =O

Never heard any behind-the-scenes quotes about it before, but even if ILM didn't intend for it to be anything other than the top of an ISD, it's something else now, and I think that's great, a whole new class, and in one of the old films, as well! 8)
Policrat'

Posts: 325
Registered: 03/08/00
Re: Welcome some BCaT VIPs
Posted: May 6, 2006 3:24 AM   in response to: Grand Moff Magn... in response to: Grand Moff Magn...
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I don't see it, I'm afraid. I see a sketch corresponding to that shot in the movie, and on the same page, a novellization reference to the Falcon rolling "around the belly of an Imperial leviathan" in a controlled spin...

That doesn't mean that the sketch equates with the ship's "belly" mentioned in the novel. I could go into rather more depth on what I think are detailed weaknesses of the argument presented on the Wookieepedia page, but I'm sure the VIPs don't want their thread clogged up with haggis - the Tector is now confirmed as the hangarless Star Destroyer, and I'm simply curious about a piece of background trivia...

Pol'

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