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Last Post:
Jul 21, 2009 6:45 AM
Last Post By: Sith Jammies
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Re: Star Wars on Trial
Posted:
Jul 21, 2009 6:45 AM
in response to: Grand Admiral S...
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This thread gave me the best laugh I've had in ages. 
I'm tempted to find this book so I can continue to laugh at it.
It's like I want to go up to the guy and say: Yes, I know it's not real. Neither is your belief that all things revolve around your opinion. :P
I dunno, maybe this guy needs more fiber in his diet, yeah? |
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5,233
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Re: Star Wars on Trial
Posted:
Jul 20, 2009 10:59 PM
in response to: Grand Admiral S...
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Makes you wonder if they have hobbies of their own or if that quota's filled with their devil's advocateness.
Here's the funny thing: one would expect that Brin would attack Indiana Jones for its lionization of colonial powers and for its portrayal of indigenous cultures. Instead, he praised it for depicting academics as heroes.
Now, far be it from me to impugn Mr. Brin's motives. But if his stated reason for disliking Star Wars and The Lord of the Rings is their reactionary politics and elitism, how did Indiana Jones, which is far more overtly offensive, escape his scrutiny?
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5,233
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Re: Star Wars on Trial
Posted:
Jul 20, 2009 10:59 PM
in response to: disturbing
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The bad thing is, he's also gone on and on about LOTR.
It's not a "bad thing" to express one's opinion, and Brin does so articulately. That said, I find his understanding of Star Wars is so far removed from reality that it constitutes a pocket universe. Nevertheless, I can't in good conscience condemn a man because his tastes in sci-fi are different than mine.
How can Luke breathe the atmosphere again?
A layer of breathable air -- actually scientifically plausible.
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907
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04/20/09
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Re: Star Wars on Trial
Posted:
Jul 20, 2009 2:14 PM
in response to: IllogicalRogue2
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What lies? Did Palpatine ever lie? I don't remember him lying. He omitted a lot, but I don't recall him lying.
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11,443
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Re: Star Wars on Trial
Posted:
Jul 20, 2009 12:25 PM
in response to: IllogicalRogue2
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How can Luke breathe the atmosphere again?
Could you imagine that scene differently? Luke comes in and his lungs are exploded and hanging from the outside of his mouth.
Edgar somethings wrong with me.......
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11,443
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02/04/03
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Re: Star Wars on Trial
Posted:
Jul 20, 2009 12:23 PM
in response to: Qui-Gon Jay
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*
Oh, there's plenty of real governments today that demonstrate that.*
:^O so true!
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2,896
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Re: Star Wars on Trial
Posted:
Jul 20, 2009 12:20 PM
in response to: disturbing
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The bad thing is, he's also gone on and on about LOTR.
Some people just enjoy complaining about things. Makes you wonder if they have hobbies of their own or if that quota's filled with their devil's advocateness.
Plus it gives us an idea of how people could accept Palpatine's lies as truth
Oh, there's plenty of real governments today that demonstrate that.
How can Luke breathe the atmosphere again?
Yeah, you're right... 
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11,443
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Re: Star Wars on Trial
Posted:
Jul 20, 2009 11:25 AM
in response to: disturbing
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*
I also love how his criticisms of the Jedi sound just like Palpatine in the novelizations.
*
Plus it gives us an idea of how people could accept Palpatine's lies as truth :^O
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907
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04/20/09
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Re: Star Wars on Trial
Posted:
Jul 20, 2009 11:08 AM
in response to: IllogicalRogue2
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The bad thing is, he's also gone on and on about LOTR.
I just love the idea that the Rebellion intended to install Luke and Leia as monarchs. Considering, you know, Vader offers Luke that in Empire and Palpy offers it again (after Palpy dies-LOL at that one)in +Jedi+? What does Luke do? IIRC, he falls onto a weather vane, almost falling perpetually until he would've been crushed by Bespin's gravity. (How can Luke breathe the atmosphere again?) And then on the Death Star he chooses a slow, painful death at Palpy's hands rather than becoming a monarch. Yeah, that's real fascist.
I also love how his criticisms of the Jedi sound just like Palpatine in the novelizations.
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11,443
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Re: Star Wars on Trial
Posted:
Jul 19, 2009 11:28 PM
in response to: disturbing
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*
I just find it amazing that my five-year-old cousin, whose first experience with the franchise involved Ahsoka Scrappy Tano, understands Star Wars better than David Brin.
*
Nice! :^O
And yet he made bank on the book- man I should write one and spout of a bunch of POV :^O
Classic! |
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907
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Re: Star Wars on Trial
Posted:
Jul 19, 2009 11:19 PM
in response to: disturbing
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continued
* Star Wars tells us to judge by looks. (Um, the Empire's all-human?)
*Elites are the only heroes in Star Wars. (Um, there's this guy, Han Solo, you may have heard of him? The dude's a third-rate drug runner before joining the Rebels.)
*Lucas favors a dictatorship. (True: The catch is it's a benign despot, which doesn't exist.)
*Darth Vader "murders billions at the press of a button". (When did this happen? I remember Tarkin doing so. Not Vader.)
*Everyone forgives Darth Vader. (Notice that Luke's the only one mourning his father.)
*Yoda saying anger is bad. Um, "Fear leads to anger. Anger leads to hate. Hate leads to suffering."
I just find it amazing that my five-year-old cousin, whose first experience with the franchise involved Ahsoka Scrappy Tano, understands Star Wars better than David Brin. |
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907
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Re: Star Wars on Trial
Posted:
Jul 19, 2009 11:18 PM
in response to: Mara Jade ©
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Well, Brin basically makes the thrust of his argument in a Salon article. But I love how he makes huge honking errors. His assertions, when he wrote the article right after TPM came out, include:
*Good and evil are easily defined. Let's ignore all the subtlety of the interaction betwen Palpatine and Padmé and later Luke.
*The Jedi rule the galaxy as of TPM. Did he miss that scene in the Senate?
*True Art Sticks It To The Man. I think defining "art" by its place in the political spectrum is itself a fascist act.
*The Rebel Alliance exists to put someone else on the Imperial throne. (Who? Mon Mothma? Leia? Luke? Because the only way Luke's getting to rule the galaxy is if he joins Palpatine and then betrays him in such a way as to make it look like an accident.)
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377
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09/24/06
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Re: Star Wars on Trial
Posted:
Jul 19, 2009 5:59 PM
in response to: S1th'ari
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*> I really never understood the purpose of this book,
and don't really want to.*
I read it, and it is an interesting read. It is really just to get some debate going, and it isn't about "hating on" Star Wars, but I enjoyed reading it and it didn't diminish my love of SW in any way. |
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98
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06/01/09
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Re: Star Wars on Trial
Posted:
Jul 19, 2009 1:34 PM
in response to: Mara Jade ©
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*Charge 3: Star Wars novels are poor substitutes for real science fiction and are driving real SF off the shelves
Charge 5: Star Wars has dumbed down the perception of science fiction in the popular imagination*
The enduring popularity of such authors as David Drake, Peter F. Hamilton and David Weber - SF writers who have not written Star Wars books - makes this allegation kinda silly.
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5,722
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Re: Star Wars on Trial
Posted:
Jul 18, 2009 11:25 AM
in response to: Sam The Smuggler
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I really never understood the purpose of this book, and don't really want to.
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49,579
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03/03/02
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Re: Star Wars on Trial
Posted:
Jul 18, 2009 10:55 AM
in response to: Mara Jade ©
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Without having read beyond the first page of this thread, sounds like someone needed something to complain about and chose Star Wars.
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Posts:
907
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04/20/09
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Re: Star Wars on Trial
Posted:
Jul 18, 2009 10:19 AM
in response to: Mara Jade ©
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Sometimes Brin takes the Star Wars vs. Star Trek thing too seriously.
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Posts:
1,109
Registered:
07/15/09
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Re: Star Wars on Trial
Posted:
Jul 17, 2009 1:24 PM
in response to: Mara Jade ©
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Those are about the complete opposite of the real Star Wars.
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144
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04/18/06
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Re: Star Wars on Trial
Posted:
Jul 19, 2006 3:34 AM
in response to: Mara Jade ©
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I don't see how this book is "Excessively negative." NOTHING is perfect, and it isn't "bashing" to say "I think **** could have been improved by ****."
This book sounds more like a discussion, where one side upholds the Star Wars mythology as it stands and the other suggests things could've been improved. If I ever find it, I will certainly give it a look.
I think it's interesting to discuss and debate with people who don't share my point of view on something.
Disagreement or not liking some aspect of something does not equal a hate fest.
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882
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Re: Star Wars on Trial
Posted:
Jul 17, 2006 7:51 PM
in response to: Jedi_Master_Tah...
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LOL! If they're making a big deal out of that, I
laugh at them. It's an older movie, and no matter how
much they try, there will be problems with the film
itself. Sheesh.
They didn't--make a big deal out of it, that is. On the plot holes charge, a list of fan-cited issues are put in the text as further evidence to support the claim. Fans brought up these points, and the prosecution decided to use them. It's convenient and compelling, so, why not? I only cited one because at the time it bothered me, but there were quite a few.  |
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